chelmsfordhammer
8:00 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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Liverpools goal given after VAR ours ruled out. You couldn't make this shit up.
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Sir Alf
7:31 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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Interesting that there is already a fair amount of criticism of Moyes tactics and selections and I assume the implication is that we lost the game in the main due to the manager ?
Now I would not place Mr Moyes at the top of managerial choices but if I ignore Sunderland and Espanyol for a moment and any associated circumstances ( if any ), and just focus on his time with us, I cannot find too much he has done that is obviously wrong and based on who owns us and who we could get I will give him to end of season to judge him. We get relegated he has failed whatever the circumstances but its a tad early IMHO to be attributing last night's defeat on him. 2 weeks in charge etc.
With Pelegrini, Bilic, to a lesser extent and even Zola, there was definitely a desire to play attacking, more , entertaining football which IMO was to please both owners and fans. They tried to recruit players, adopt tactics and formations etc. aimed at meeting demand for the "West Ham Way" which is an intangible thing that seems to equate to the passing style and skilled players of the Greenwood and Lyall years?
But to be effective at that you have to have better technical players in the team and a strong squad containing good back ups / yongsters
It happens everytime. we try to play this stylish "West Ham Way" football without the players to make it successful and then have to bring in a pragmatic manager that plays "attrition football" to keep us up. It happened after Grant, Zola and Bilic. Each was replaced with a pragmatic man to stave off relegation or get us back up again.
The root cause is of course the owners. The time to invest is after a successful season ( success for us is top 8 or a cup win). This is the one thing we have never ever done. 1986 a prime example. After finishing 3rd we needed another strong midfielder at least and bought no one.
All our owners see a good season as a reason not to invest. Last season we did ok but our owners decide they need to recoup the previous season's high spend. Did Sullivan think our squad was complete , strong and ready to go to the top 6 because we finished higher than usual? Well he wanted to because his and Gold's and Brady's priority was to recover the large spend with a net spend of 25 million and to reduce the large wage bill hence the sale of Hernandez.
And back to the criticism of Moyes and implication he cost us the game? Which manager could be suggested that would have in 2 weeks had us playing much bette and not had only defenders on the bench ( Ajeti or U23 options the only forward options) ?
Would Guardiola, a far better manager based on trophies etc. have set us up differently with different selections that would have seen us do much better? We can assume Pellegrini , a far more successful manager would not of?
The whole point is the squad, the options available are the root cause. Unbalanced, slow and old. The problem this season is Sulllivan, and Gold who decided to not invest and to recoup the large spend of the prevous season.
Moyes has in 2 weeks made us look better organised, more solid and far less likely to concede 2 or 3 goals every game. He has 2 quality strikers and one is injured. He has a bunch of attack minded midfielders but only 1 defensive minded ones.
This is a long verbose ( Use 50 words when one will do) way of saying that Moyes did not have too much to do with last night's defeat. IMHO of course.
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Sniper
7:26 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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Oh and I’d rather VAR had been used last night to ounish the hundreds of fouls Sheff Utd committed throughout the game that were just ignored. Especially that twat of a right back Baldock who was allowed to literally shove and barge cresswell and masuaku away from the ball every time he had it
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Sniper
7:23 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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Said all along that that I’m not wholly against VAR but the processes around it’s usage are awful.
As for rulings about offside and handball in the build up to goals, the way these have be implemented in line with VAR have increased the level of unfairness and controversy they were meant to be solving. VAR should be used to stop things like Wilson’s handball against us away at Bournemouth a couple of seasons back when he scored. Or chicarito scoring with his hand last season. But not things like last night or Antonio against Southampton - nobody seeing that back in a replay would have been complaining it was a handball.
It seems the laws and their interpretation are being set by morons who have no clue about the game, and then VAR issues are being looked at by, as someone stated earlier, the same idiots whose mistakes caused it to be introduced in the first place.
It should be used to stop blatant mistakes and punish off the ball incidents of serious foul play. I dont want a game where you can be offiside by half a millimetre. Or one where, as Michael Owen pointed out last night, you can no longer effectively explain to a youngster what is and isn’t handball as it depends on who is attacking and then what happens afterwards.
It’s all nonsense and I’m hating every second of this season
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Lertie Button
6:42 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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So if Martin was signed to be used in training sessions only who is our third choice keeper
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zico
6:29 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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Duncan Donuts 3:39 Sat Jan 11
To be fair David Elleray was a twat on a par with Keith Hackett!!
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Hammer and Pickle
4:53 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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Somehow this reminds me of the Rollerball storyline in 2000AD.
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charleyfarley
4:48 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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Or maybe we could fit a complete sleeve (arm to hand) that beeps when the ball comes near so you can move it out the way
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Northern Sold
4:44 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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Cough... bit like last night... no one in the crowd or on the pitch or commentator thought it was a red at first... then it's the usual slow it down make it ten times worse... and overturn it... seen plenty just as bad this season that were a yellow... going back 10 years would have been maybe a caution...
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cygnet
4:37 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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Re Charleyfarley: Unfortunately even it touches your arm it would be deemed handball. Perhaps they should change the term for it to 'armball'. That's pretty much what it is.
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Far Cough
4:32 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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The player who got hacked down*
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Far Cough
4:31 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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... as just proven with the fella just sent off for Arsenal...
Sold, I never saw it but from what I understand it was a blatant red, the player had to go off
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arsene york-hunt
4:27 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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The problem with VAR is that it is being looked at by the same fucking useless refs that caused it to be brought in in the first place. It has not really worked out well for West Ham overall.
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chelmsfordhammer
4:17 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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spot on charley, im losing interest in football rapidly. I only ever watch anyone else other than west ham if ive got a bet on it. The game is being destroyed with the petty tinkering of the rules that seem to be created for no other reason than to keep someone in a job because its certainly not done to improve the spectacle.
Every week no the talking point seems to be about the ref's/ var decisions rather than what's actually gone on during the matches.
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Northern Sold
4:11 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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Spot on Charley F.... in an absolute nutshell that
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charleyfarley
4:04 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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Well we now have defenders with their hands behind their backs looking more like speed skaters than footballers, what next? shorts with pockets in so when we attack we can be sure our hands don't touch the ball, we can all reflect on what might have been, but these handball rules are ripping the soul out of football and taking away the enjoyment. For me I'll take that one on the chin last night if the authorities get to grips with this whole thing and get the game back flowing and not killing it. If not it will slowly destroy the game. Life in the majority of cases is about balance and the balance needs to be restored for the excitement and the good of the game whilst trying to maintain fairness
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fraser
3:59 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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But as a defender he's allowed to accidentally handball it as long as it doesn't lead to a goal..
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Percy Dalton
3:59 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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Apparently UEFA are not happy how the FA are interpreting the handball rule saying unless it's clear and obvious situationsike that the goal should stand.
In other words anywhere else other than England the goal would have stood
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Rusta
3:59 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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I was surprised in today’s football that the lad who hacked down Anderson from behind just below the knee didn’t get a red or even a mention of it
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Northern Sold
3:55 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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I honestly don't know anymore... like I said earlier... not one Blade defender or fan screamed handball... and yet it has been overturned with the so called correct decision... football is an absolute and utter mess at the moment...
... as just proven with the fella just sent off for Arsenal...
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Duncan Donuts
3:51 Sat Jan 11
Re: ⚽ Sheff Utd v West Ham - Official Match Thread
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NS,
Nobody seems to be picking up on the fact that after Haller nodded the ball on to Snodgrass the latter attempted to flick the ball over Egan who raised his arm and deflected the ball into the path of Rice (and it was then Egan who headed the ball onto Rice's arm).
The ref was about 8 yards away and must have seen the original handball but presumably played the advantage...
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